The Value Creators Podcast Episode #63. Systems Thinking in Action: Building Community-Of-Passion Based Businesses with Joe Zentmyer

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How do you build a retail business around passion—and scale it successfully? What does it mean to think in systems, not just solve problems?

In this episode of the Value Creators Podcast, Hunter Hastings speaks with serial entrepreneur Joe Zentmyer, founder of Snaggletooth Goby and builder of thriving passion communities—from indoor climbing gyms to tropical fish hobbyists and service ventures. Joe shares how he applies systems thinking, relationship-building, and detail-obsessive iteration to create businesses that endure and expand.

Key insights include:

  • Why systems—not checklists—create scalability and resilience.
  • How community, location, and hospitality converge to generate value.
  • The importance of building teams that thrive in uncertainty and complexity.

This is a hands-on masterclass in entrepreneurial systems design, filled with hard-earned lessons for anyone seeking to grow a values-driven, experience-based business.

Resources:

➡️ Learn What They Didn’t Teach You In Business School: The Value Creators Online Business Course

Connect with Joe Zentmyer on LinkedIn

Learn more about Snaggletooth Goby

Connect with Hunter Hastings on LinkedIn

Subscribe to The Value Creators on Substack

Knowledge Capsule:

1. Systems Thinking Is the Entrepreneur’s Superpower

  • Many founders jump from problem to problem without ever building a system.
  • Systems allow entrepreneurs to step back and let their business run, and not be consumed by it.
  • Joe Zentmyer emphasizes: “If there’s no process, the same problems will keep resurfacing.”

2. A Business Is a Puzzle—And Entrepreneurs Must Love Solving It

  • Joe sees his ventures as complex puzzles with interlocking systems.
  • He thrives on balancing operations, team dynamics, and creative problem solving.
  • Obsession with the system can be productive—if balanced with personal clarity.

3. From Vision to Replication: Systems Enable Scale

  • Each new climbing gym was hard, but systems made replication possible.
  • Over time, Joe built a system for teams to independently manage real estate, construction, launch, and operations.
  • Institutional knowledge—like climbing wall design and layout—became internal IP.

4. Community Is the Core of Passion-Based Businesses

  • Joe builds businesses around passionate identity: “I’m a climber,” “I’m an aquarist.”
  • Authenticity matters—customers want to be around others who feel it.
  • The best engagement comes from shared language, hospitality, and consistency.

5. Location Is Strategy

  • For niche businesses, there’s no McDonald’s-style data formula.
  • Objective factors like foot traffic combine with gut-level assessments like safety, vibe, and accessibility.
  • Joe chose sites near transit to lower costs and serve the community better.

6. Trust-Based Partnerships Enable Growth

  • Success depends on trusted relationships: real estate, contractors, investors.
  • Joe spent years assembling a reliable team across disciplines.
  • Being known for follow-through and fairness makes systems more robust.

7. Creative Problem-Solvers Are Essential

  • Early-stage ventures require improvisation and initiative, not rigid process followers.
  • Hiring for adaptability and curiosity is key during expansion and chaos.
  • “You can’t automate creative problem solving,” says Joe.

8. Marketing Passion Brands Requires Empathy and Simplicity

  • Deep experts often alienate newcomers with insider jargon.
  • Joe partners with generalist marketing firms to maintain accessibility.
  • Marketing must serve both the hardcore enthusiast and the curious beginner.

9. Experience Creates Loyalty

  • Whether climbing or aquarium care, the in-store experience is key.
  • Events, workshops, and personalized advice bind people to the brand.
  • Customers remember how they felt—and that memory drives retention.

10. Recurring Revenue Is the Engine

  • Joe looks for business models with built-in subscriptions or services.
  • Climbing gyms rely on memberships; aquariums offer in-home services.
  • This structure stabilizes cash flow and deepens engagement.

11. Systems Must Integrate with External Environments

  • Joe’s strategy adapts to zoning laws, transit incentives, and macroeconomic trends.
  • In Chicago, locating near transit hubs reduced parking costs and aligned with city planning.
  • Entrepreneurs must plug into broader institutional systems intelligently.

12. The Founder Needs a System, Too

  • Joe carves out time weekly for reading, writing, and system-level reflection.
  • He warns against being consumed by the business’s internal systems at the cost of personal well-being.
  • Sustainable entrepreneurship requires a personal system for focus and renewal.

The Value Creators Podcast Episode #62. Choose the Handle That Holds. Stoic Leadership and Everyday Integrity: A Conversation with Becky Schmooke

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How we lead is who we are.

In this episode of the Value Creators Podcast, Hunter Hastings speaks with Becky Schmooke—entrepreneur, leadership coach, and author of Choose the Handle That Holds. Becky shares how the system of philosophy we label as Stoic generates practical tools for leadership, self-awareness, and resilience. Rather than hierarchical leadership vested with titles and administrative control, Becky proposes a more human vision of leadership: grounded in personal values, emotional clarity, and active participation.

Key themes include:

  • Why authority and leadership are not the same—and how leadership is a lifestyle, not a position.
  • How Stoicism reframes control, responsibility, and purpose in business and life.
  • What it means to “choose the handle that holds”—and how to build emotional intelligence through action, not theory.

This conversation is a guide for anyone who wants to lead with clarity, build resilient organizations, and live aligned with their deepest values.

Resources:

➡️ Learn What They Didn’t Teach You In Business School: The Value Creators Online Business Course

Buy Becky’s book: Choose The Handle That Holds

Learn more about Becky Schmooke

Connect with Becky Schmooke on LinkedIn

Connect with Hunter Hastings on LinkedIn

Subscribe to The Value Creators on Substack

Knowledge Capsule:

1. Leadership is Who You Are, Not your position or title

  • Leadership is often misdefined as authority or power tied to position.
  • True leadership is available to everyone, regardless of rank or role.
  • It’s who you are and how you turn up every day
  • Great leaders are also great followers—engaged, empathetic, and collaborative.

2. Teams Should Be Made of Leaders

  • Hierarchical models miss the value of shared leadership and active participation.
  • Individuals in high-performing teams, like Olympic athletes, take turns leading based on context.
  • “Followership” is powerful when it means knowing when to support and when to step up.

3. Choose the Handle That Holds

  • As described by the stoic philosopher Epictetus, each situation has two “handles”—ways to approach it.
  • The “handle that holds” is integrity, courage, and ownership—not blame or denial.
  • Leaders who choose the right handle foster resilience and long-term trust.

4. Integrity Requires Personal Definition

  • Integrity isn’t one-size-fits-all; it depends on your individual values.
  • Defining what matters helps guide decision-making under pressure.
  • Businesses without this clarity often chase hollow definitions of success.

5. The Four Stoic Virtues are Practical Anchors

  • Wisdom, courage, justice, and temperance shape steady, resilient action.
  • These values ground behavior and decision-making amid external chaos.
  • For example, temperance (moderation) keeps us focused on long-term process over short-term wins.

6. Values-Driven Business Builds Market Trust

  • Living your values builds credibility with customers, employees, and partners.
  • Consumers reward integrity and are more forgiving of missteps when trust is earned.
  • Purposeful entrepreneurs create subjective value that the market recognizes.

7. Control is Internal, Not External

  • Stoicism teaches us to distinguish between what we can and cannot control.
  • In business, focusing too much on outcomes breeds anxiety and inefficiency.
  • Small, consistent actions aligned with values are more impactful than rigid plans.

8. Planning Must Be Flexible and Purpose-Driven

  • Plans aren’t inherently bad, but rigid ones can trap organizations.
  • Stoic-inspired planning involves adaptation, feedback, and clear purpose.
  • The real test is knowing when to stay the course—and when to shift it.

9. Purpose Should Anchor Personal and Business Life

  • Individual purpose must be discovered and aligned with everyday actions.
  • Companies can also have purpose—if it’s lived, not just printed on a wall.
  • Purpose sustains integrity under pressure and fuels long-term innovation.

10. Hierarchies Can Work—If Culture is Right

  • Flat organizations are inspiring but hard to scale; hierarchy isn’t inherently bad.
  • What matters is cultural leadership at every level—ownership, not obedience.
  • Debriefs, shared accountability, and transparency help flatten behaviorally, if not structurally.

11. Stoicism is Emotional, Not Emotionless

  • Big-S Stoicism engages deeply with emotions—it doesn’t suppress them.
  • Emotions are data; curiosity is the default reflex for emotional intelligence.
  • A “leadership reflex” (like the parenting car-arm) pauses reaction and invites insight.

12. Unshakable Purpose is the Supreme Aspiration

  • Seneca said it best: our longing is to be “not shaken” by events.
  • That inner steadiness is the outcome of living Stoic values every day.
  • Leaders who cultivate this internal strength create enduring impact in uncertain environments.